13 messages in this Archive |
| Posted: 28-Sep-04 - 03:01 PM By: Mike Cartier |
| Hammer Fist |
| Looks like he is striking downward with the fist and forearm together. |
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| Posted: 21-Oct-04 - 04:26 PM By: David S. de Lis |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| On the other hand, it looks like the one on the ground is surrendering... |
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| Posted: 11-Jan-05 - 01:19 PM By: Haydn Iuchi-Sutton |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| The fact that they've tried to fit the image to circular format might mean that the context is lost -i.e. ground or standing etc. Actually I'd guess that it is mainly aesthetic/symbolic with little detail of actual methodology -the guy on the right appears to be submitting.
As for whether it's a downward hammerfist -looks more like a block of some sort to me. But I expect they used hammerfists. |
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| Posted: 13-Jan-05 - 10:16 AM By: Mike Cartier |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| Actually the hammerfist was a very popular punching technique, and really part of the reason for the distinctive stance (see pankration article in articles section)
I will have a Punching style article out soon too. |
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| Posted: 05-Apr-05 - 05:37 AM By: Paul Allen |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| I agree with the various alternative suggestions -this could easily be any of the above, or it could be "buffeting" (striking with the inside forearm) or indeed, a block to lay the opponent open to the punch apparently being launched with the back hand. The apparent ability of the attacker to control his opponent in this way might explain why the other is submitting - he is "no longer in a condition to defend himself". |
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| Posted: 07-Apr-05 - 12:09 PM By: Mike Cartier |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
I don't really see how what the fighter on left is doing could be seen as a block? What is he blocking? the submission finger?
The circular manner of the image does nothing to detract from the technique being used, the fighter on the left is coming down upon the fighter on right. landing with the hammer fist which can be he fist or any part of the forearm. The evidence for hammerfists lies in the stance.
I think it pretty clearly shows an in action fight with the fellow on the left overunning his opponnent and striking with some sort of arm or hand attack at the end of his flurry. The fellow on right is surrendering as he goes down, the submission probably happened a bit after the attack but they had to fit the info into the static image.
If there is two thing i am sure of in this reconstrctiion it is the stance and the hammer punch which stems from the stance. The stance is probably the most frequent sourced image. In addition eye wiotness accounts of ancient boxers and pankration fighters mentions the style that the fighters used. That is they would rise up on ther top toes to strike down upon the opponents. This is fo course only one of the ways in which they punched. |
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| Posted: 11-Apr-05 - 01:57 PM By: Paul Allen |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| Quote "The submission probably happened a bit after the attack". Precisely - after the right hand fighter's counter-attack with his right arm had been blocked."What is he blocking? The submission finger?" Was that sarcasm? How very Greek! (Sarkasma = flesh-tearing - not the ideal way to conduct a discussion). I have no problem with it being a hammer-fist strike - it's one of my favourite techniques - but I'm interested in all the possibilities. |
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| Posted: 12-Apr-05 - 08:18 AM By: Mike Cartier |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
touche, yes it was slightly sarcastic i guess, not intentional I assure you :)
I too am open to any and all possibilities. |
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| Posted: 20-Jun-05 - 06:28 AM By: johann |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| my two cents tp this discussion: it couldn't be that (as it appears to be in taiji) that hammerfist punch isn't a block at the same time? have a look at the left guy ,his palm is clenched. i guess that he intended to strike his opponent but after recieved the hammerfist-punch he just did submission. it's just my humbly opinion |
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| Posted: 21-Jun-05 - 07:38 AM By: Mike Cartier |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| yes i guess that could be possible, but it seems a bit more likely that its a strike and the opponent is submitting after a powerful strike. The hammer fist is a very strong punch |
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| Posted: 22-Jun-05 - 06:38 AM By: johann |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| yes, perhaps you're right Mike and i just followed my imagination and interpreted it too much. but as far i know greeks were pagmatically oriented and, if not in this particular case, it was possible for them to slightly modify blocks to use them as strikes |
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| Posted: 22-Jun-05 - 06:05 PM By: Mike Cartier |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| well the way to test it would be to try it out in free sparring with an uncooperative opponent. The hammerfist is itself not recognized as a useful punch by most people especially modern boxers but through testing we have found it to be a useful addition to the standard boxing punches.
I will think about what your saying for a while and try a few things out, thats the beauty of this sort of online interaction. It gets you to thinking in ways you might not, thanks for the input. |
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| Posted: 23-Jun-05 - 03:59 AM By: johann |
| Re: Boxing Technique |
| no problem, pleasure is mine. many, many years ago (when i was a lad), i read some polish book about martial arts, one of polish martial arts historician. he was focused mostly on eastern arts but in this book (i don't remember its title) he mentioned about pankration (it was the first time i heard of) as the art of striking and kicking. but the point is that he said that strikes was mostly hammerfists-like (in my language we don't call them hammer fist but "strikes with the bottom/cap of a palm" or so). whether it's true or not, i guess his notice is worth of consideration. |
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